View source for You very clearly explained to me once in a letter that if the spirit soul then goes into the brahma-jyotir, he is considered still fallen. Still fallen. Does that means the whole brahma-jyotir is composed of fallen souls?

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{{terms|"You very clearly explained to me once in a letter that if the spirit soul then goes into the brahma-jyotir, he is considered still fallen. Still fallen. Does that means the whole brahma-jyotir is composed of fallen souls"}}
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[[Category:Questions asked to SP... 1971]]
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<div id="Conversations_and_Morning_Walks" class="section" sec_index="5" parent="compilation" text="Conversations and Morning Walks"><h2>Conversations and Morning Walks</h2>
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<div id="1971_Conversations_and_Morning_Walks" class="sub_section" sec_index="4" parent="Conversations_and_Morning_Walks" text="1971 Conversations and Morning Walks"><h3>1971 Conversations and Morning Walks</h3>
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<div id="RoomConversationAugust171971London_0" class="quote" parent="1971_Conversations_and_Morning_Walks" book="Con" index="20" link="Room Conversation -- August 17, 1971, London" link_text="Room Conversation -- August 17, 1971, London">
<div class="heading">Yes. This is also forgetfulness. In the brahma-jyotir you are forgetful still. Because you are... That is stated in the śāstra, anādhṛta yuṣmad anghrayaḥ.
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<span class="link">[[Vanisource:Room Conversation -- August 17, 1971, London|Room Conversation -- August 17, 1971, London]]: </span><div class="text"><p style="display: inline;">Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa is also... Everything is there. But actually, it is Kṛṣṇa, but we cannot see. Idaṁ hi viśvaṁ bhagavān ivetaraḥ. The whole cosmic manifestation is Kṛṣṇa but it appears it is different from Kṛṣṇa. Idaṁ hi viśvaṁ bhagavān ivetaraḥ. This is acintya-bhedābheda. So unless we accept the thesis or philosophy expounded by Lord Caitanya, inconceivable one and different... Inconceivable. For us it is inconceivable. You cannot have any clear distinction. Therefore take it as inconceivable, acintya. But from theoretical or by logical conclusion, everything is one: Kṛṣṇa. That's all. And another example is that the finger is myself, but I am not finger. This is the position. The hair I am. I am the hair, but I am not hair, at the same time. This is like that. This is called acintya-bhedābheda, inconceivable.</p>
<p>Revatīnandana: A related question also: just like there is at the same time the oneness is there, there is distinction, then, between the spirit...</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: That distinction you cannot make clear.</p>
<p>Revatīnandana: I know. But still it's, not clear, but clear, there is some distinction, where a distinction...</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Distinction, there is distinction, there is no distinction.</p>
<p>Revatīnandana: Yes, simultaneously.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Simultaneous. Now, which one will we accept? Therefore inconceivable.</p>
<p>Śyāmasundara: You can't accept one or the other; you have to accept them both.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Yes.</p>
<p>Revatīnandana: Everything is related in Kṛṣṇa.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Yes.</p>
<p>Revatīnandana: Yes. But there's also, amongst the related things. There are related things because there is also diversity amongst them.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Must be.</p>
<p>Revatīnandana: That's right. In preaching, in the movement, that there is no diversity between the jīva souls who are living...</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: But there is diversity. Why not?</p>
<p>Revatīnandana: And the brahma-jyotir. They are saying...</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Brahmajyoti is combination of jīva soul. And brahma-jyotir is emanation from Kṛṣṇa. Brahmajyoti is coming from Kṛṣṇa. This is a function. Heat is coming constantly, incessantly, from the fire. But still, heat is not fire. You cannot say heat is fire. Fire is far away.</p>
<p>Revatīnandana: That's right. So the constitutional nature of the entities that naturally form brahma-jyotir is the same as the constitutional nature of the jīvātmās that are forming the living entities?</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Yes. It is comparison, a small spiritual spark. That's all. We are spark. So long it does not develop a body... That body is also the same. So it remains as spiritual spark. But because it is spirit, it cannot remain in that impersonal stage. He wants to enjoy. So, so long he has forgotten, he develops a body which is called matter.</p>
<p>Śyāmasundara: Or else he develops a spiritual body? One or the other?</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: No. He is spirit, spiritual identity already. But as we are developing material body, similarly we can develop spiritual body.</p>
<p>Revatīnandana: You very clearly explained to me once in a letter that if the spirit soul then goes into the brahma-jyotir, he is considered still fallen. Still fallen. Does that means the whole brahma-jyotir is composed of fallen souls? You see my question? If I go there, I'm a jīva soul, and I go to the brahma-jyotir I'm still fallen.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Yes.</p>
<p>Revatīnandana: That means all jīva souls there are also fallen souls.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Yes.</p>
<p>Revatīnandana: That follows?</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: That is explained in the Bhagavad-gītā. Vibhinnāṁśa. Separated parts. Separated parts, vibhinnāṁśa. You can call it fallen.</p>
<p>Revatīnandana: But we usually think of fallen as being forgetful.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Yes. This is also forgetfulness. In the brahma-jyotir you are forgetful still. Because you are... That is stated in the śāstra, anādhṛta yuṣmad anghrayaḥ. Anādhṛta. They do not know how to adore the lotus feet of Kṛṣṇa. That is forgetfulness.</p>
<p>Śyāmasundara: So they become separated.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Yes.</p>
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