Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: ...walk this way. There's a ravine here. (break) Śrīla Prabhupāda, it always seems that there is some kind of inspiration for spiritual life there. Is that simply mental concoction, or is it actually a fact, the land itself?
Prabhupāda: Land. It is the influence of the land. Just like Vṛndāvana. Whatever you may be, you stay here, you become spiritualized. Simply you stay there. (break)
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Is it possible to reform a person against their will?
Prabhupāda: No, not possible. (break)
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: ...sign, Śrīla Prabhupāda, that someone is actually having change in heart?
Prabhupāda: Hm?
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: What is the sign that someone is actually having change in heart?
Prabhupāda: By his action. (break) ...kasipu tried to make Prahlāda atheist. He failed. And Prahlāda tried to make his father theist. He failed. Don't you see?
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Yes.
Prabhupāda: So unless one agrees you cannot turn him. It is not possible. Five-years'-old boy, staunch devotee, and the powerful Hiraṇyakaśipu, father, who is threatening with his life and so many ways he tried that "You become atheist, godless. Otherwise I shall kill you." He did not agree. And similarly, the son also solicited the father that "You have got so much power by the grace of God. Why you are becoming atheist?" Both of them could not turn to their side. Prahlāda remained Prahlāda, and Hiraṇyakaśipu remained Hiraṇyakaśipu. (break) ...can expect that without agreeing, conceding, one can be reformed. No, that is not possible. Impossible.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Not simply by rubber stamp.
Prabhupāda: No, that is not possible. He must agree, "Yes." Therefore guru is required. Guru means, accept guru means, "Whatever you say, I will accept." That is guru. Otherwise friendly talk. Friendly talk will not do. To accept guru means "Now I accept you, guru, my instructor, without any argument," and that is acceptance. "Whatever you say, I shall do." That is agreement. Then he can be reformed. Śiṣyas te 'ha śādhi mā prapannam: "I surrender unto you. I become your disciple. Now you train me." Then he can be reformed. Otherwise not possible. (break)
Devotee: When we were at school we accept a teacher and he teaches us mathematics or something like this, but when it comes to spiritual life and we accept a guru, people criticize by saying, "Oh, you're not thinking for yourself anymore."
Prabhupāda: Yes, you have surrendered. You say, "Yes, we have surrendered. That is the way." Tad viddhi praṇipātena (BG 4.34). The first term is "surrender," praṇipāta. Otherwise it is not possible. If one does not surrender, there is no question of reformation. He must voluntarily surrender: "Yes. Whatever you say, I shall do." Then things can be advanced. Otherwise not possible. (end)